The Profitable Warmachine  

nightstalker172 38M
1646 posts
6/12/2006 12:57 am

Last Read:
7/22/2006 4:12 pm

The Profitable Warmachine

Go here to get the full story The Fallen Haditha by the big man himself
I got into a debate on his blog and I decided to move it over here because well I start talking and I cant stop anyway here is a post of his reply to me and to get the whole story visit the above post.


Oil was a factor in going to war with Iraq, but not the only factor or even a major factor.

I doubt 9/11 was allowed to happen. If that was true, the plane which was headed for the White House would not have gone down in Pennysylvania.

They say that the passengers on-board took over the cockpit and crashed it. I personally think that the Air Force shot it down once they realized it was the last plane still in the air and the other had already taken down the towers.

They would shoot a commercial plane down in a second if there was any possibility it was hijacked and headed for the White House.


My resonse that i had ready is as follows but unfortunarly it became too long so I moved it over here

Div - My point exactly....and you dont think that they couldnt have shot down the ones that hit the towers?...once it was known to be off course which could easily have been detected MILES away from the buildings like I said those planes are tracked and honestly I think that allowing the towers to be hit would have a bigger impact on the people then it would if the White House was hit besides why would the govenment actaully put any key memebers in any danger.....and a story of people attacking the hijackers might as well make those people out to be noble and all...They would never allow anything to happen to the capital...and I wont even get started on th Pentagon no one even knows what hit that building but it was no missle perhaps...smaller plane perhaps but doubtful considering the speed that the object caught on film was going

Now exsplain to me what are the reasons in your mind that we went to war with Iraq. We completely bailed on Afghanistan and the hunt for Osama and turned our attention to Iraq. For some reason...Could it have been that Saddam wanted to raise oil prices to an insane high? So we figured that why should a mad man profit when we could just easily take it from him. All the noble reason that they "claim" where orcistrated by them to begin with..if you think about it....

Lets look at another attack on America shall we. Pearl Habor....Now if you look at different aspect of how they tell this story. Supposedly the Jananese fleet was scouted out about a week before the attack. The crimes happening in Europe where our allies NEEDED us to help fight but the president did not have the support of the people at that time to go to war. People over here felt that its their fight let them deal with it. Thus I personaly think that a strategy was developed to turn the tide of the people in favor of going to war. Japan had planned to attack us no matter what that much is true. The plan of Japan was to SPECIFICALLY target our carriers.. They wanted to cripple our air abilities in the Pacific. But all the carriers just "HAPPEN" to be away from the attack and the other ships such as battle ships etc...were left in as bait so to speak for the attack. because what better way to rally the people to your cause then to make them believe that they are under attack. After Pearl Habor was attacked the polls shifted in favor of going to war. And thus we entered WWII...Now of course who the hell would want anyone to think that a government would put its civilians at risk to accomplish a goal.

Granted I admit there is no proof of this and why would there be...History is written by the victors and they can shape the events however they want.

Personaly I think a similar event happend 9/11. The government needed an excuse. And see all they have to do is get you to HATE a certain type of people. Look what happend in WWII with Japanese people here put in consentration camps for their own protection it was just Japanese either..if you look asain you were a target...As they say all turbins look the alike right....I doubt very many people even knew that Afghanistan and Iraq are two different places. All they would have to do is to start a rumor that Osama was an operative of Saddam which is what all of a sudden Saddam is the "real threat" and finding Osama is not even on our minds. Bringing freedom to a coutry that lived under and iron fist of oppression and cruelty. Propaganda perhaps? Rally the people to bring the same way of life and "freedom" to another coutry oh such a noble cause really. And what are we in America? Are we free? Our lives are much better than most countries I will not argue that. but are we free? Or are we slaves with an ILLUSION of freedom. which is the best way to control a slave by giveing it the illusion that they are free. Do you think you own the property your house sits on?...or do you pay rent to uncle Sam? Property Tax/Rent? Same thing? Income Tax is unconstitutional right? but they brought it back anyway? because without it a government cant function...

now lets look at the fact at present. Who has profited from this war. The innocent women and children who died in bombings by us? NO...howabout the Iraqi people in gerenal are they liveing any better than when Saddam was ruleing the place? Doesnt look like it now does it. The only place that has seen ANYTHING positive in this war are in fact the oil companies. And Bush's family owns one...and Like you said the only thing that people ever see on here is what the media decides to share with us....and who says that the government doesnt regulate that? Oh and lets not forget the last time a Bush was in office...what did we do?...oh yea...Desert shield protect the OIL!!!

All the media bullshit is slight of hand so to speak its magican drawing you attention from one thing to another to keep you from seeing how simplistic his trick really is. The simple truth about Iraq IS OIL or to be more accurate OIL PROFITS...which broke records WOW!!! Think about it...a smart businessman would want to secure a product or resource that everyone uses oil for exampe. Now you make more money if you get a direct line to it or should I say you own the land that the oil was found on. And what better way to increase profits then to make everyone THINK that its becomeing scarce...(which actaully it could be Im not saying that it isnt) but it would be a great way to drive up prices of I dont know EVERYTHING...because Oil is needed to make Gasoline and Gasoline is needed to make cars GO..and cars are needed for people to make deliveries of other goods such as food etc...the simple domino affect. In turn that make all large corperations very happy with swelling profits...So who loses...oh the people do...and the funny part one is the wiser because we will all believe whatever the great and wise squar or rectangular oracle that sits infront of us as we gaze into its massive amounts of lies and make believe...

Let look at numbers then....1000+ vauleable tax payers..die so that BILLIONS of dollars can be made in the long run in oil profits...hmm to a buisness man where down side?....what? people have to what Ill be rich HA HA HA! and you cant tell me that people cant be that evil...
But I have to respectfully disagree with you Division I think this war had one simplistic purpose and that was to secure the financial future of many oil companies including the ones that the Bush family owns...They are the only ones that have gained anything from this atrocity against the Iraqi people and our own soldiers. And as I said History is written by the victors and this war will probably be remember as the war that freed Iraq...

Granted I know there is no proof of my claims and this is honeslty just my personal opinion based on what history has taught me. But of course the govenment would never admit to something like would be bad for their image and they might actaully cause another revolt amongst its people...couldnt have that could we.

8337 posts
6/12/2006 10:49 pm

Opinions, Opinions.....

I think profit in many forms was a consideration for Bush and the right to make their case for war, but I don't see it as a simple matter of black and white.

I personally believe that Bush had Saddam on his agenda ever since his father failed to take him out of power the first time around.

It was just a matter of justification, something that he could push as a platform, an agenda.

Bush and Cheney have stock in many of these companies that subcontract with the military over in Iraq as well as the oil companies who would profit from a subsidized agreement once Saddam was ousted.

As far as the planes crashing in the WTC, from all accounts available, these planes went off course so quickly that there was virtually no warning and not enough time to alert the Air Force.

Even if the Air Force had been alerted, there were no planes in the vicinity that could have shot them down in time.

It simply was a case of the hijackers executing their plan to perfection.

The last plane in the air was shot down, I believe, because by that time the situation was already known and the Air Force had been dispatched.

I'm looking at the bigger picture, nightstalker, and believe me, there is more to this than oil.

9/11 would never have been allowed to happen, even Bush is not that callow.

I don't buy conspiracy theories this outlandish.

Our lax security allowed those terrorists access to our planes and once they had that, those planes were going down and there was not much we could do about it.


"My every move is a calculated step, to bring me closer to embrace an early death." -Tupac Shakur

nightstalker172 38M
1258 posts
6/13/2006 7:18 am

Div - Now the planes going off course...there was a full hour of radio silence before the first plane hit. Which is abnormal. Could they just simply not have exspected something like that perhaps...but most hijackers do so to take hostages right...and they make silence would be a bit odd no matter an hour to decide whether or not this plane is a threat...since the plane was so completely off course and had radio could deduce that something is just not right...Hang up about launching fighters to shoot down said planes...I can give you that. they had no idea what was going down..ok an hour to decide if the plane is a extreme threat and notify authorities in time to launch fighters to intercept...That does seem reasonable. However the 3rd plane to hit the pentagon could have been prevented...(if indeed it was a plane to begin with) The forth plane was very likely shot down like you said...and the cover story of the passengers retakeing the plane was of course to make those people who died needlessly appear brave AND it would be bad PR is the government actaully shot down a passenger plane.

Ok lets say for the sake of arguement that the attack was indeed not known by our own government....why are we still in Iraq....Where is the evidence that Iraq or Osama Bin Laden had anything to do with the attack? Basically we have to trust that everything that our goverment has said is in fact true. being in psychology like you are know that people as a whole when something has wronged them they immediatly look for someone to blaim. In the hightend emotional state of everyone in this country all one need to do is CLAIM they saw something or someone...there doesnt even have to be evidence..All you have to do is say there is and the people will back you 100%. but now everyone has had time to cool down and look at the situation....Most people have lost faith in their goverment and anything it spouts out...Like the plane crash into the pentagon for example...where is the planes remains? Some have speculated that the aluminium was super heated because of the speed they where going...and it evaporated...yea ok not that much plane is going to evaporate in 5 seconds...or even 10 seconds..the wings perhaps...but thats leave a pretty good chunk of the plane left...Now I admit I have viewed some of the conspiracy theories some are outlandish and some make you think....most of them however are discredited as lunitics...Im not saying they arent either...but to take the word of the goverment and media so blindly as truth is in itself crazy.

Outlandish as my theory of many that I have...this is just one extreme to my train of there more going there a bigger picture....

Here is another theory of mine you may disagree you may not. Global warming has become something of a consern...What is the number one cause of global warming? The fossil fuels that we burn to run our everyday equipment to make life as we know it function. (Im in no way an environmentalist or anything of that nature) Now Oil is the prime source of fossil fuel. It is used in everything from airplanes, cars, etc....Without these machines we would not be able to get to work on time, shipments would not arrive on time etc...OIL is a very important resource. Not just for America but for the world as we know it. Eventaully in our own greed and stupidity the earth could one day not support human life because of green house effect which would cause the earth to be too hot in most areas to be habitable (this too is a theory but stay with me) Now say this is true. And the earth becomeing a not so good place to live is actaully not so far off...what is it that we can do to slow down or stop the erosion of the Ozone layer...that would be to stop the useage of burning so much fossil fuels all around the world.

Now if you where a buiness man who had a product that made billions because everyone in the world used it well your buniess would be in jeopardy. Since it seems that the useage of your product will come to a hault..and you KNOW this ahead of time. best to squeeze out every dime you can reasonably get before you have to close down. Well anyone with this kind of knowledge will want to profit from it as well. You look out in the market today the trasition to do away with fossil fuel cars and such is already starting. The hybrid cars are starting to come out and a few years time cars that run purly independant of gasoline or anything combustable will be obsolete if even illegalized. to the oil companies who at this time have control of the most used product in the world will as they say no longer be at the top of the food chain so to speak.

Then again global warming could be another farce or slight of hand to distract us from something else. Who knows really....

but back to the point of us being in Iraq. It isnt about footholding the most precious resource on this planet than what is it about....further more I think that this Iraq war was simply to test our capabilities and have a foothold to launch from...there is already talk of invadeing the other middle eastern countries....after all they have oil too. And what exactly is oil....oil is a resource that can be sold at whatever price because everyone needs it. The one who controls the oil pretty much controls everything else. and THAT control is what this Iraqi war is really about. Where is the evidence of Weapons of Mass Destruction. Did they even ever exsist? There are too many loop holes in our own governments stories for them to be really considered as fact.

What if Im right and not only did the government know about the attacks but even perhaps endorsed them...Could a human being sarcifice thousands of lives in order to make Billions of dollars and have control. Hilter did alot of other dictators in histroy....Is Bush like Hitler?....that I cant say...I wouldnt even be able to say if Bush has anything to do with it and its some other third party that would benifit from America being at war...Who knows but if I go with my gut...I will say for certain that our government is up to something more and I think we are going to see it very soon. Look at all the "freedoms" we have given up as it is in order to be "safe" Is it a better way to perhaps keep control over its own people? One thing the government knows is you have to be carful with a it doesnt turn on you.

I cannot disagree with you that there is perhaps more going on than just oil...perhaps oil is a prelude of getting is power and oil is money...but I will not put it past a leader or government to sacrifice its own people for its own gain....its been done in many countries before...Is Bush really the tyrant? or simply a scapegoat to blAIM it on?...

The point is I have lost any and all faith in the government that runs this country. Innocent people adults and children alike and our own honorable men and women who serve in the military do so to protect us are being sent to be slaughtered for something as stupid as a peice of paper with a dead president on it. Those little slips of paper those little notes of emtpy promises are all that this capitalist country holds dear....and its sad....

popmuse01 36F

6/13/2006 6:05 pm

Hate to get into a discussion without knowing the 'full' details...BUT one thing I think you both are forgetting is that back in the 80's (or 70's not sure) BEFORE Bush I was in office, the US helped Saddam GET into power in Iraq. Unfortunately once they figured out he wasn't exactly the person they thought he was (geez...who'da thunk? ) well Bush I was in power and WHAM we are in the Gulf War. Reasons why we didn't get him the first time: 1. some bitch squealed on the SPECs who were ordered to take him down. She claimed Genevia Conventions and we were "Going against them" 2. They were bombing the shit out of the Oil fields...another reason why prices did go up...some of the refineries that US money had built and Iraqi people ran were gone, so the demand on the remaing refineries increased.

As for 9/11...I honestly think that Clinton ignored the obvious signs that something was being consipired (yeah he was too busy getting his dick sucked), and when it happened, well Bush II was in office. I agree Night that that was no plane that hit the bf will agree...there is a movie called 'Loose Change'(you'd have to google it under movies/videos I think ) that focuses on 9/11 and even though most of it is BS, there is some truth to it.

Global warming is a hoax by the government. The temp of the earth raises what...1 degree every....10 years or so? warming my ass...the damn earth shifted a bit from the last time the sun had a solar storm on it, cauzing the poles to move to a degree that I can't remember, but significant enough that it litterally shifted the earth's weather patterns, water current patterns in the oceans (why do you think we've had major hurricanes and earthquakes?), and yes, caused the polar ice caps to melt in the North quite a bit faster cuz yes, they techincally are closer to the sun by so many degrees. Every major weather disaster in history has been related b/c of a solar storm on the sun I bet. Mother nature is having one hell of a time adjusting to the new magnetic pull of the poles.

I'm leaving the site end of March. To those who want to keep in touch, see blog for details.

nightstalker172 38M
1258 posts
6/14/2006 7:55 pm

The whole point of this I guess is I just get annoyed when people blindly follow the ramblings of the media...They just assume that everything presented to them is truth...I have a wild imagination that much is true. I will be the first to say that I could be wrong I have very few written in stone facts...but same could be said for the media...Is the main goal of this war oil?....If oil = power then yes....power = control....The more I read about and see the more I disaprove of our governments with not just this war but other things as well...

Popmuse - that is another thing...Saddam was not a threat he was an employee that wouldnt do his job...which would be another reason to take him out...kind of odd that we seem to try to put leaders into power that will work for us and when they dont...the go quetly into the night....Was Saddam a good man?...fuck no...he was a threat to his own people...
As far as the whole global warming thing....Im not really so sure its a could be I wont rule that out...but to say that we arent damaging the planet that I wont agree with..and actauly lately the temp raises about 1-2 degree a year not ten years..thats how its been the past couple years...which is not normal...that could also very well be because of a global shift...but I dont think we are helping things reguardless....If anything I would think that if there was a global would be kept secret avoid world wide riots and such...but who knows the government spews out so many lies everyday...who the hell can tell whats true and whats not....but typically as history has taught us....the ones who are either kept quiet and deemed insane....typically are closer to the truth than most people would believe...

Notjustmanmeat 52M
39 posts
7/1/2006 8:19 am


Notjustmanmeat 52M
39 posts
7/2/2006 3:07 am

damn this no outside links policy, if anyone has an interest in these matters look on google for someone called Michael Ruppert.

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