posts 5/1/2006 12:48 am
5/5/2006 9:43 am
Spanish US Anthem
I noticed a tidbit on Friday about Bush complaining of a record released by Wyclef Jean of the US anthem sung in Spanish.
"I think the national anthem ought to be sung in English," he said.
Other peoples commnents were "Would the French accept people signing the La Marseillaise in English as a sign of patriotism? Of course not."
But also "There are a number of renditions that people aren't happy with, but that's part of it - that it means enough for people to try to sing."
Does anyone remember God Save the Queen by the Sex Pistol's?
Do you have an opinion, right, wrong, don't care, what's all the fuss about?
I feel that there is a fundemental difference here in how Brits and Americans view institutions of state and country but I could be wrong.
posts5/1/2006 4:02 am
I'm sort of on the fence here. I agree I want to hear the national anthem in English...that's me. And I speak five languages, so it's not for lack of understanding others. It's tradition for me and I like it.|
However, I also must note that nowhere in our Constitution does it say that we have a national language. The face of immigration--legal and illegal--has changed; the sheer quantities of Hispanic people in the United States is increasing on a high-speed trajectory, and not everyone feels the need or has the educational opportunity to assimilate anymore in terms of language. Actually, arguably this all happened at various points in our history...with each wave of immigration from other areas of the world, the parents did not always assimilate well, but their children and grandchildren did. My husband's grandfather never taught his kids Spanish, and actually they suffer for that a bit these days with the quantities of Spanish speakers in the DC area.
And if we want to make those people feel included in terms of pride of the nation--want to become citizens or at least legal permanent residents--is it such a big deal to allow them to sing the national anthem in Spanish? Isn't that better than not having them sing at all? Just a thought.
|rm_lagano replies on 5/1/2006 5:17 am:|
Hmm maybe I don't have all the info...
So correct me if I am wrong..
Isn't this meant to be a sort of protest song rather than a suggestion that the actually anthem should be sung in various languages to suit the audience.
I took as the equivalent of burning the flag i.e. making a political statement.
posts5/1/2006 5:23 am
You might be right...this is what I was using as source material:|
The translation was purported to be pretty faithful...so if there is another movement to make it more of a revolautionary/political statement, I wasn't aware of it.
posts5/1/2006 7:43 am
ha, the link didn't post... go to about dot com and do a search under spanish anthem|
|rm_lagano replies on 5/1/2006 7:56 am:|
Strange the link was there for a while, I did see it must be the AdultFriendFinder police that removed it lol
posts5/1/2006 2:05 pm
Don't give them an inch! I'm tired of all this bi lingual crap. This is America! Our Constitution was signed in English by Ex-European people, not just British. Our laws are written in English. Our Government is run in English. Our national anthem was written in English! We didn't all speak English when we got here. I don't see many airport signs here in Bohemian! America is made of people from all over the world. Why should we give special treatment to only one group of people. If you want to live here, learn the language? How far would Sid get in HK if he didn't speak the language? Or is he one of those Brit's that assumes everybody in the colonies should understand the Queen's English. I bet the Chinese never thought of English as anything but a business necessity.|
Come play naked in the sunshine and dance naked under the stars.
|rm_lagano replies on 5/1/2006 5:09 pm:|
Well I am all for a country maintaining its national identity.
I am at times somewhat sorry that over the last 30 years the UK has lost some of its "Britishness" as it has become multi-cultured.
It is a complex and sensitive subject though.
As for language in HK, it is interesting to compare HK and Singapore (though what significance this has to the topic I don't quite know).
Singapore has been independent of the UK since the early 60's. They adopted English as there official language, even in school's english is used. I think there policy was english everywhere except at home when mother tongue could be used. I think they took the view that english was vital for business and that although it would be a struggle for a few years eventually the issues would fade as the community efffectively adopted english, The standard of english in Singapore is very high, all Singaporeans are fluent and has remained so till today.
HK reverted to chinese rule in 1997. Officially the country is bi-lingual. Children are educated in chinese in primary school, switching to english in secondary school. All officials business like courts, police, government operate bi-lingually. We have 4 TV station 2 english, 2 chinese. All road signs are in chinese and english.
The standard of english is generally poor. The chinese community will communicate at all times in chinese and only switch to english when it is necessary. This stems from colonial rule where there were two distinct communities the locals and the rulers if you will and english was not adopted by locals but simply used when needing to communicate with the rulers. Of course its generally very easy to get around with english only, as restuarants, business etc are bi-lingual especially in areas that are for tourists or business but at times it can be a bit difficult to be understood. Over the last 8 years the goverment has flip flopped several times over the language for education, first it was suggested that switching to mother tongue would benefit children as the could concentrate on subjects not on learning english, but declining english standards has seen that idea abandoned. It seems every other year there is some new proposal on how to arrest the decline in english standards. English standards have declined substantially over the last 25 years and are continuing to decline here.
Actually I dont speak chinese though I can understand it to some degree, this is simply becuase I don't need to as the country is bi-lingual.
So you might be able to infer from this that if english is enforced then eventually it will dominate and standards will be high, if you allow a bi-lingual approach then the community wont really adopt english and standards will decline and it will be a struggle.
posts5/1/2006 6:08 pm
So, you would agree that a bi lingual society doesn't work as well as one with a single unifying language? |
Come play naked in the sunshine and dance naked under the stars.
|rm_lagano replies on 5/1/2006 6:25 pm:|
Yes I would.
The bi-lingual nature of HK is a significant weakness. Kids in particularly are caught in a trap. Their english is not good enough so when they hit secondary school they struggle, imagine if you were trying to learn algebra in french and whilst at the same time trying to learn french but if you switch to mother tongue to resolve that then english standards decline even faster and english is required for international business and HK is an international business center, part of its attraction to foriegn business's is the pool of english speaking people.
I have longed believed in HK it needs to switch to one language or the other particualarly for education.
I think there needs to be support for helping people integrate but that if you maintain the bi-lingualism you just perpetuate the problems. If you switch to one language the problem is gone in a generation.
I will admit there are differences in the issues faced in the US as with a continuing and from what I understand increasing flow of immigrants so there isn't a stable community to integrate which makes it harder.