Should we believe?  

rm_JUSTsex4me 36F
157 posts
6/1/2005 10:24 pm

Last Read:
3/5/2006 9:27 pm

Should we believe?

Ok, so I know that I told all of you that I would usually deviate from talking about sex on every post. Well, here is another one of them. First off, I would like to say that this blog does deal with religion and the existence of God. If you feel like you would be offended by a piece that casts a doubt on the thought then please do not read any further. However, if you are like me and can respect the opinion of others then please read on. And if you disagree with my opinion, then, again, please add a post and let me know yours......
Many of us believe in the existence of an all-good,all-knowing, all-powerful, perfect being who created all in the world. I'm not doubting that someone did create all of this but I am doubting the idea that this being is all-good or even close to perfect. Example number innocent child dies in a burning building or is murdered by an unloving parent or even a stranger. Question: Why would a being with infinite powers and undying and unconditional love allow this to happen?? This "being" could stop this and prevent the suffering of an innocent and cause the wrongdoer the suffering in return. Many people will agrue that "God" has a place in heaven for that innocent child and the wrongdoer will burn in eternal fire. Look at it this way though.....that wrongdoer gets to live their life out and the childs life is ended and thought to have gone to a place that we are not even sure exists.
Many people also attribute these acts to the fact that "God" gave us free will and without it we would be a very boring and bland race. Ok, but he could have limited that free will in a way that we could not cause suffering to innocent people who do not deserve it. Now, lets take away the subject of free will. What about natural disasters? Those are not examples of a person harming another of their own free will. An all-loving, all-powerful "God" would not allow that to happen.
That being said, I do not believe that the being we believe to be God is all-loving or perfect although s/he may be all-knowing. This leads me to believe that we were put here for the sick amusement of a being or as a mere experiment that would allow this being to see how long it takes for us to self-destruct.
I apologize if I have offended anyone by this blog and if you have an opinion different than mine then please feel free to post it. I will not delete any responses and I will not ban anyone from posting for merely disagreeing with my opinion. However, please respect my opinon as I will yours.

wyvernrose 38F
3895 posts
6/2/2005 2:27 am

"Ok, but he could have limited that free will in a way that we could not cause suffering to innocent people who do not deserve it."

Ahhhhhhh but then it wouldn't be free would it?

"What about natural disasters? Those are not examples of a person harming another of their own free will. An all-loving, all-powerful "God" would not allow that to happen."

Natural Disasters are only disasters from our perspective as we see death as a tragedy rather than simply a natural progession of our being....what you refer too as natural disasters are normal healthy phenominon of our earth constantly regenerating itself, without the earths movement what would happen? without the wind, rain storms etc what would our world be?......dead..... wouldn't that also be a disaster, what would life be without death? is that what you want?

what you refer to as a disaster is the renewal of life, religious people would draw similarities with volcanoes to Christ......he rose again....others would use the pheonix as an example although mythical in nature shows the life cycle of volcanic area's which are lush fertile area's....

It isn't that I don't agree with you but that I can see too many flaws in your reasoning to agree....

Nature alone is a facinating thing with all of it processes and renewal of life, everything having it's turn and then supporting the life of another through it's death or even dying as the consequence of life being renewed, it is quite amazing......only people who see death truely as a tradegy could possibly consider life or more specific death as a tragedy, is it a tragedy as you no longer have them when you want them? or is it the tragedy because you regret things said, done or rather not done during their life?

live your life without regrets and death is not the monster you is just a part of life....


wyvernrose 38F
3895 posts
6/2/2005 2:31 am

hmmmmmmm not sure I explained that well hope you understand what I tried to say....

the all powerful being you speak of is only a joker etc as you suggest if you consider the given as other than what it is.....

it is your own perceptions of those things (i.e. death), which shape your perceptions of what you see of theology....


no_strings_grrl 44F

6/2/2005 8:12 am

I agree with many of your thoughts here. Personally, I believe that organized religion is nothing more than a tool used by human beings to manipulate the masses. As to whether a 'God' exists or does not exist, I am not so arrogant as to claim to know the answer to that, but there is one thing I do know:

Many, many people claim to love God (or Jesus or insert diety of your choice). I'm going to piss some people off by saying this, but to me this is total horse shit. When your 'God' gives you a set of rules, the free will to make your own choices based on logic, and then sends you to hell when you fuck up? You don't love that 'God'. You fear that 'God' - or rather, you fear the consequences of not claiming to love him or her.

As you said, why give us the free will to choose and then sentence us to eternal damnation if we don't make the right choices? What's the fucking point of that? You hit the nail on the head when you said if there is a 'God', it sounds like we're here for his amusement. And I certainly don't love or worship a 'God' like that. And neither does anyone else. They're simply afraid to admit it because they MIGHT GO TO HELL. To these people I have one thing to say: If your 'God' is the powerful, all-knowing 'God' that you think he is, he knows that love has nothing to do with it and that you are motivated by fear alone to worship and follow him. Isn't that lying? Isn't that a sin?

freeisnotaword 60F

6/2/2005 8:12 am

I respect your point of view and find it interesting that you picked AdultFriendFinder to right about God, but since you did my thoughts about God is that he did give us the power of free will and that's exactly what is going on today. Our generation is probably the most violent one and it's us as people who are killing one another. Sure God can prevent this from happening but why should he if he gave us the power to free will? We are the ones that decide to take the life not God. We are the ones who decide to kill someone or to love someone. To live in peace and get along with others or to fight and go to war and hate. God gave us the right to do what we want with life. If we want to be a better society we need to live by the Bible, Koran, Torah or whatever religion we believe in and keep our faith in God and to trust him. The things that are happening now is not Gods doings but man and only man can stop the violence.

no_strings_grrl 44F

6/2/2005 8:15 am

And by the way, you've won my readership. I like how you express yourself and are not afraid to approach sensitive subects. I'm looking forward to reading more of your thoughts.

rm_JUSTsex4me 36F
185 posts
6/2/2005 1:27 pm

I appreciate and respect all of your opinions that you posted to my blog. I just have a few things to add and comments to make. First of all, you probably noticed that I do not believe in the God that is popularly believed in. I do not believe in the scientific hypothesis that the world was created by a big is simply too complex and unique to attribute it a mass of matter coming together as do human beings themselves. Although I did drag it out a bit, my intention was to argue that the creator (God, Lord, etc...) is far from being the all-perfect or all-loving being that we were raised to believe.

As far as the concept of free will being to blame for everything......I think thats a load of horse shit (no disrespect to anyone who disagrees with me). An all-knowing being who felt that they had created a perfect planet where their "children" could live together would have known what the consequences of granting 100% free will. Lets go back to the beginning of time and say that God,as we were raised to view him, would not knowingly grant free will to a race that he knew would ultimately end up destroying his perfect planet and each other. That is not the picture of a perfect, all knowing being. Simply put: There may be a being who created us and everything around us but that being is not all-knowing, all-loving, all-powerful or perfect.

wyvernrose 38F
3895 posts
6/2/2005 5:24 pm

Justsex life isn't about not being able to make mistakes it about learning......

if you can't make mistakes how can you learn?

what would life be without the freedom to learn? the drive to know....
According to the bible it is what saw Adam and Eve cast out of eden, he shut the doors of eden, the paradise and so it is still untouched even by other than the fruit if you take it literally.....

with freewill comes consequences.....

many in society have lost sight of that....TOO MANY which is a big part of why for some life is as horrifying as you portray....

your asking to have freewill without consequence.....

the world is a pletora is interconnected systems that work unbalance the delicate scales and there are consequences this is something the world is learning on the large scale and was how it was live in it you have to learn that such is the case.....and how to retain the balance.....the asian philosphies teach this as the yin and yang very interesting actually but they have something there indeed, the taoist teachings are very interesing on their own....

but to be without what makes the world 'bad' would it be 'good'


rm_Belswingcpl 38M/41F

6/4/2005 2:10 pm

Well an interesting post to find on a site like this.

I guess I will come at this from the religious stand point for a time, and then talk about my beliefs which are separate from these.

Yes some religious people believe that God is perfect, all knowing and all good. They also believe that Satan is evil to the core and out to destroy everything that God created. There is that saying that god works in mysterious ways, and that is true to religious people. They believe that everything happens for a reason, they might not fully understand what that reason might be at the time it happens, but in the end they think he has some greater design then just to make them suffer.

Then you add in the Satan effect who is out to undo everything God created through destruction, temptation and any means at his disposal. Some believe that Satan is behind all the suffering in the world.

Religious people come at it from one angle, the ripple effect. A great tragedy might befall them, a death of someone in their family or something just as bad, but that the good effect from such a tragedy might not directly affect them but someone else. There is a cause behind it and the effect from that cause will spread out to affect others, in good ways at times, or bad ways depending what choice that person makes. Everything that god does is another challenge for them, a choice to be made. They can make the right choice or wrong choice; it is always up to them.

That is the way I have seen them act in my time and their beliefs.

Also onto one thing. About the world being perfect. No god didn’t create the world as a perfect creation; he created Eden as the perfect creation. Then Adam and Eve, tempted by the serpent picked the fruit of the tree of knowledge breaking god’s one rule there. Because of that he kicked them out of Eden and gave them free will to make decisions, either good or bad. It is now up to them to find the answers in life and to live as best they can.

Ok now onto my personal thoughts. I agree with Wyvernrose there about the natural disasters. They are a part of life, and they are the way the world renews itself. There is nothing evil or cruel about them, that is why they are called natural. In fact if humans weren’t living in places prone to natural disasters there wouldn’t be so much human death. They all have a choice to live in those places or not and accept the risk that comes with living in those areas.

As for free will, if you limit it in any way it is not free will. To me everyone, and I mean everyone has a choice in life. the guy who places a gun to someone’s head has a choice to pull the trigger or not, the guy who is a has a choice to do that or not. The mother who she looses it because she needs sleep and kills her new born child out of stress has a choice or not. In all the decision that people are capable of making they have many choices they can make, but all too often I see these same people blame others for the choices they do make when they are the wrong choices. Very few ever accept the personal responsibility for their choices, it is easier to blame others, it is easier to pass it off to someone else. It isn’t so easy to live with the consequences of ones decisions.

To me God isn’t cruel or evil, and believe me I have been through a lot in my life and continue to go through it on a daily basis. With all that has happened in my life I could be bitter and hateful towards the divine being. I could blame him for all the suffering I have been through, all the pain and agony and all the horrible memories. But I don’t. the reason is this, I come from a different mindset then most.

To me these aren’t the games of someone who is playing with my life. I mean to believe that God takes a personal interest in tormenting me is quite frankly highly egocentric, I mean after all why would someone with that much power focus on me and not someone else. I go by that and this, everything that happens to me no matter how horrible has a reason behind it. what that reason might be at the time I don’t know, it might not come to fruition for decades. To me it is what I do with these horrible things that happen to me in life, that is what matters. Not the pain or agony but how I use that suffering to conquer those challenges thrown at me and how I can make it benefit someone else. I believe fully in fate, what is meant to happen is meant to happen. That includes life and death. I don’t fear death in the least or fear going to hell. If that is where my path in life leads me then so be it. I freely made all the choices and I will fully accept all of the consequences of those choices.

When I talk about this, I haven’t had an easy life, far from it.

I was born dead with the umbilical cord wrapped about my neck. I asked my mother about this on my birthday just a few days ago, and come to find out the doctors gave up on me and just as they were backing away I started moving and breathing. Was I too stubborn to give up on life so easily or was it god who brought me to life again, or it could just have been luck that I took a breath and my heart started beating? I don’t know, then comes the age of two. I got electrocuted by sticking a key in a plug, so much electricity flowed through me that it melted the key to the wall. Then shortly before that I started to show signs of seizures, at three I was diagnosed finally with epilepsy.

That is not a great thing to have, I spent a lot of my early years in the hospital having tests run, having experimental medications used on me and suffering the effects of the meds. At 7 I suffered through a very severe case of ADHD and still do to this day. I was on Ritalin for a year before they pulled me off it from the side effects with it mixing with my seizures meds. I had to learn to deal with having adhd in school without medicine, no one to hold my hand, no one to help me. I still managed to always get A’s and B’s. I could have blamed god at that point for all the struggles, but I just accepted them as what is meant to be and to rise above them and move on.

Then at 12 I was sexually molested by a doc, it took me a while to accept it and move on. at 17, in 1995 I had over thirty grand mal seizures in a single two hour period. We just got off for spring break and I was watching TV. The next thing I know the following day I wake up in a hospital room unable to move my arms all that well. I lost over 2/3 thirds of my memory permanently, I can’t remember anything before I was 12/13 years old. I forgot how to write, almost forgot how to read, couldn’t even feed myself for a few days. I got over that and moved on, I could have sat there and blamed god for it again. Curse him for all of time but another challenge to get over. I eventually worked past the partial paralization on the left side of my body, relearned to write though it isn’t neat as it was before, and once again relearned everything I forgot study wise. But then the following years my seizures got worse and worse and I had to drop out, a week after I did I got my SAT score back, 1589 I was hoping to go to MIT. That dream was crushed. I spent a few years finding myself again, making new dreams and eventually met the woman who would be my wife. I never would have met her if not for everything that happened before that, because she lived in another country on another cost of the continent. All the decision I made up to that point led me to meeting her.

We had one child, on Christmas Eve we lost our second child, then a half a year later we conceived our third. The loss of the second was horrible, but without that loss I wouldn’t have my youngest daughter right now and I treasure each and every single moment with her.

Up to this point I could have cursed everything that has happened to me, blame some faceless entity and fallen into despair. I could blame others for the stuff that has happened to me, but I didn’t I just accepted it as another challenge and moved on with my life. the lessons I have learned from them have made me a better person, one able to understand personal tragedy and how to over come them. I have always tried to help out others, from a dear friend in another state she needed support while going through a trial against her father for molesting her. if not for my own molestation I would not have know how to help her through that. Everything happens for a reason, you just got to keep your eyes open for that reason.

Just two months ago I went to the eye doctor for a check up. the news I got back was not good. Eventually I will go blind from cornea degeneration, I will need a transplant if it gets worse. Should I fall into despair and blame god for this?

I am an artist and a writer, someone who uses vision to make a living. The answer for me is no, just another hurdle to overcome again.

And sorry for the long post, but there is a lot to address in just simple questions.

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