Lost Innocence  

VTLakesideVixen 60F
185 posts
8/24/2006 9:01 pm

Last Read:
8/28/2006 10:00 am

Lost Innocence

About 4pm today our local afternoon programming was interrupted for a tragic breaking news story.

School in Vermont typically starts in about a week from today. Teachers and other workers have their school start about two weeks earlier.

Today their day of preparation at Essex Elementary School was interrupted by a spurned boyfriend on the rampage with a gun.
His girlfriend's Mother was a teacher in Saint Albans who had left her classroom early today because she was worried about her daughter. She was the first person to die at the gunman's hands. The school was only half a mile away from this home. His girlfriend wasn't close at hand when he got to the school, but he spotted a first grade teacher--he shot through the glass in the door to end her life. He continued his hunt until he found his girlfriend, then he shot her as well as another woman that was in the same area.

The gunman knew what he had done was wrong. In his haste to flee this second crime scene on foot he had to cross the backyards of the school's neighbors. Unfortunately there was a man in his garden pulling weeds--the gunman took only a fraction of a second to decide this man needed to be shot also.

At this point I don't know if the gunman was running out of bullets or if his fear of a future life to be spent in jail got the better of him. Whatever it was going through his mind, I guess he figured it would be easier just to end his own life. He shot himself in the neck.
He is now in the hospital expected to make a full recovery, as are his girlfriend, her fellow worker and the man who was in his garden.

Two teachers paid with their lives for his feeling of being "disrespected" because his girlfriend had the audacity to take out a restraining order against him.

For my own part in trying to make sense of these murders--well, it makes me wonder the gunman had to receive medical attention.

Why not let him bleed to death from his own self inflicted wound?

What would have happened if that school had been full of children?

Does feeling "disrespected" entitle someone to murder anyone they choose?

Has life gotten to the point that you are afraid
to send your kids to school?

Does anyone believe in capital punishment anymore?

Will those children be able to feel safe and learn now in the school that was the site for two murders?

How many people are going to want to continue persue a career in teaching with crimes like this happening in our schools?

What can we do to prevent this from happening again?

I know I don't have any answers. I am very sad at what is too often happening at our schools.



economickrisis 55M

8/25/2006 12:14 am

Thats tragic

I hate guns and I have no patience with people who claim its their right to bear arms.

What a pity the arsehole didnt simply put the gun to his own head and blow it off when he got out of bed this morning.


tadpudgy 56M

8/25/2006 3:09 am

Alot of heartfelt and deep questions are asked in the wake of a tradgedy. No one knows what sets the mind to go on a rampage. Are we ever going to feel completely safe when we walk out the door and just go about our daily lives? Take care Miss Vixen. HUGS!


VTLakesideVixen 60F
458 posts
8/25/2006 4:58 am

    Quoting economickrisis:
    Thats tragic

    I hate guns and I have no patience with people who claim its their right to bear arms.

    What a pity the arsehole didnt simply put the gun to his own head and blow it off when he got out of bed this morning.
You know, I am starting to feel this way sometimes--about the right to bear arms---although I'm not sure that I trust any government to guarantee all of the rights that I am entitled to right now if they were to start tampering with our Constitution. But I do agree with anyone that would severely restrict gun possession and use! I think that anyone who uses a gun in the commission of a crime--EVEN a crime of passion as this seems to have been should automatically receive a life sentence in jail, with absolutely no right to appeal this sentence. I think that if a death results in the commission of a crime due to gun use then the criminal should receive the death penalty, which would not be allowed to appeal (except if there is a question as to who was the shooter) and the sentence should be carried out as within a years time. And while I know this won't probably be popular, it is MY OPINION in carrying out the death penalty the criminals should not be shown any more compassion in how they die than what they (the criminals)showed to their victims!


VTLakesideVixen 60F
458 posts
8/25/2006 5:14 am

    Quoting rm_mzhunyhole:
    How horrible..I'm all for the death penalty..what good it is..I'm still waiting for them to put my brothers killer in hell..he's been on death row almost 20 years.
MzHuny I am so sorry for the loss of your brother--I send you my deepest Condolences and prayers for you loss. I am sure that even though is has been 20 years since your loss, you still feel it as keenly as if it were yesterday when you think about him.

It is for this exact reason that I feel the way that I do!
Please see my reply to Economickricis. Hopefully, it explains how I feel.

MzHuny I can only imagine the pain and outrage that you feel as I have never experienced this type of loss first hand, but I know myself well enough that I would want a just punishment carried out immediately if I were in your place.

Again MzHuny, you have my prayers and deepest Condolences.

Hugs to you Sweetie.


angelofmercy5 59F
17881 posts
8/25/2006 5:30 am

In the olden days, they would have just strung him up without a trial....and that in itself kept alot of people from committing crimes. What a sad shame that was.


VTLakesideVixen 60F
458 posts
8/25/2006 5:31 am

    Quoting tadpudgy:
    Alot of heartfelt and deep questions are asked in the wake of a tradgedy. No one knows what sets the mind to go on a rampage. Are we ever going to feel completely safe when we walk out the door and just go about our daily lives? Take care Miss Vixen. HUGS!
Thank you Tad for your pertinent comment. To answer your question, No Tad, I think that time of "innocence in spirit" exists no longer. Gone are the days of daring to sleep out on your Grandmother's screened in porch, gone are the days when everyone could go out and not have to lock their doors, gone are the days when everyone knew and trusted everyone in their own community.This is a very sad, bad time that we are living in Tad.

It is a very depressing thought that the future seems to hold only more of the same for us.


VTLakesideVixen 60F
458 posts
8/25/2006 9:58 am

I agree--one of the ones he shot has had their condition downgraded, so it is not looking so good for her. I sure as hell hope she doesn't die!

Thanks for commenting TakethemoneyRUN.

Hugs,

Vixen~~!


VTLakesideVixen 60F
458 posts
8/25/2006 10:09 am

    Quoting spunky11961:
    Why didn't someone just put a bullet right between his eyes,save some taxpayers dollars!
    ~spunky
Aw, Spunky unfortunately that would have made one of the police have a real hard time--but He, the GUNMAN was released from the hospital this morning. He is to be arraigned in a little while. Knowing the bleeding hearts that we have for judges up here in Vermont, he will be out walking the streets, free to do it again! Judges are right to protect freedom and justice, but they should definitely MAKE the guilty pay for their crimes!

Thanks for commenting Spunky.

Hugs to you Spunky.

Vixen~~!


howaboutahuck 66M
489 posts
8/25/2006 11:00 am

The law; The right to bear arms was written during a time when every man in the country hunted to survive. Today that law should be stricken from law books with the exception of military personnel on duty. Hand guns and semi-automatic weapons should be outlawed. Rifles for the soul purpose of hunting should be kept in vaults and issued to their owner for target practice on site and when shown a valid hunting license, and issued for the period that license is valid for then returned to the vault. Anyone committing a crime with a weapon of any kind should be locked up for a minimum of 15 years and there should be no early parole. Anyone found guilty of murder should not get a second or third trial, they should be executed in a little room behind the court room ten minutes after the judge slams his gavel. The person that was murdered didn't get a second or third chance.


brute472 74M
3480 posts
8/25/2006 2:51 pm

The law of the west had its merits and a quick stringing up to the nearest tree would save a lot of anguish for the surviving families that are left with the pain of their loss.
But and I say a big but where the guilt is obvious I agree with the death sentence and it should be carried out in a short time but where there is some doubt I am not sure because it has come to light since DNA testing that some people on death row would have been executed but were innocent of the crime they were sentenced for.
I am no academic so I do not know the answer but under the right circumstances I totally agree LV.
HUGS to you too.


AstirRelicLatah 64M
1993 posts
8/26/2006 5:03 am

This is our form of American Terrorism. We have an epidemic of gun violence in our country. In our little part of the world, we rarely get to see these mindless actions...go to the inner cities of America and it's a daily occurrence...The people who have those living conditions live with a realistic fear of being shot and killed on a daily basis. The shooter comes from that background...his actions are absolutely wrong, but that's what he grew up knowing...can't we find a better paradigm for our own citizens to follow?


VTLakesideVixen 60F
458 posts
8/26/2006 7:22 am

    Quoting howaboutahuck:
    The law; The right to bear arms was written during a time when every man in the country hunted to survive. Today that law should be stricken from law books with the exception of military personnel on duty. Hand guns and semi-automatic weapons should be outlawed. Rifles for the soul purpose of hunting should be kept in vaults and issued to their owner for target practice on site and when shown a valid hunting license, and issued for the period that license is valid for then returned to the vault. Anyone committing a crime with a weapon of any kind should be locked up for a minimum of 15 years and there should be no early parole. Anyone found guilty of murder should not get a second or third trial, they should be executed in a little room behind the court room ten minutes after the judge slams his gavel. The person that was murdered didn't get a second or third chance.
I agree with you on all points Except for the execution point! I would do DNA testing, mental health testing and allow one appeal or retrial if the defense we able to provide significant new evidence, or evidence of proscutorial/police misconduct. They would have a total of ONE year to do this--
otherwise they would be executed in the same way that their victim died.

A few questions Huck. How would we enforce the changes in law that you propose regarding gun ownership? How do you make sure that handguns don't get imported into this country illegally? How do you compensate the gun manufactures who can't make their product any more? How do you round up all the guns that are already out there?
All things to think about!


VTLakesideVixen 60F
458 posts
8/26/2006 7:28 am

    Quoting brute472:
    The law of the west had its merits and a quick stringing up to the nearest tree would save a lot of anguish for the surviving families that are left with the pain of their loss.
    But and I say a big but where the guilt is obvious I agree with the death sentence and it should be carried out in a short time but where there is some doubt I am not sure because it has come to light since DNA testing that some people on death row would have been executed but were innocent of the crime they were sentenced for.
    I am no academic so I do not know the answer but under the right circumstances I totally agree LV.
    HUGS to you too.
Brute, you have made a very good point! If it were up to me, I would totally revamp the US justice system. This way all current death row inmates would be taken care of one way or the other, and there would not be a long build up because after a year that the new system was in place executions would commence. Please also see the answer that I gave to Huck regarding trials and guns.

Hugs to you Brute!


VTLakesideVixen 60F
458 posts
8/26/2006 7:58 am

    Quoting AstirRelicLatah:
    This is our form of American Terrorism. We have an epidemic of gun violence in our country. In our little part of the world, we rarely get to see these mindless actions...go to the inner cities of America and it's a daily occurrence...The people who have those living conditions live with a realistic fear of being shot and killed on a daily basis. The shooter comes from that background...his actions are absolutely wrong, but that's what he grew up knowing...can't we find a better paradigm for our own citizens to follow?
Skier it seems obvious to me where you are coming from but I do not buy it as an excuse for what this criminal has done. There are many people out there who have grown up with all types of abuse and violence that do not go out and kill. This criminal may not know or have many communication skills, but he could have continued to use the ones that he did have or just made use of common sense and let her go her own way. He did not own her!
It turns out that he has a lengthy criminal record for violence in MA with just this type of thing. This type of crime just doesn't happen--it is something that builds up from not stopping violent tendencies in youths. I do have to agree with you that we as a society must change--otherwise we are going to not only destroy ourselves but as the rest of the world adopts our norms it too will end up destroying itself.


elysianpleasure 47M

8/26/2006 9:11 pm

jeez... what's wrong with these people. traggic. He should have just put the first bullet in his head and been done with it.


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